"Sound Check" We’re Doing a Groundskeeping Podcast!

In this teaser episode for the ABI’s new podcast “Ground Etc.” Matt Metzger and Scott Holmes talk infield grooming equipment, what it really means to be an innovation company, and what’s to come in this infield grooming season of Ground Etc.

Transcript

- I'm Scott Holmes.

- I'm Matt Metzger, and you're listening to Ground etc.

- This season we're gonna be talking all things infield grooming, from routine maintenance, to leading a grounds keeping team, to serious renovation work.

- We talked to experts of the field, on the grounds, the work, et cetera.

- Oh, that was good.

- You're welcome Scott, when you first met Kevin, Kevin owned a hydroseed company, and some people may know what that is, some people may not. But specifically, how did you make that pivot then when you're working with Kevin from hydroseeding residential commercial properties, to sports turf? How did that happen?

- Well, the old saying, the mother of invention is necessity. This was necessity. So this was right around 2008, '09, right when we were growing by a hundred percent. So we started the company in '99, and every year we had a hundred, 150, 200% growth. You know, it was just this constant explosion of entrepreneurialism and growth and new products. And one of the key products, well the very first product called the TR3 Rake, I had taken up into Chicago, and did a demo just on the spur of the moment to a baseball complex, a softball complex.

- No kidding.

- And they liked it. Now, looking back, I don't know why, but they did, 'cause we have better things now. But at that point, they ended up buying like 10 of 'em from us for the city of Chicago, for all their parks and recs. And this was probably in 2006 or '07 that I sold them. And 2008, '09 came in, as the world knows, the economy crashed, banks stopped loaning money, and it became very difficult to survive on just one or two products or one or two markets. And so Kevin and I made the decision that we were going to make a shift from the equine and landscape market, and add a third market which would be sports turf, simply because of a little bit of experience with the parks and recs in Chicago. Now the one thing that ABI, Kevin and I know is that we don't know everything. We don't, I know you think we do or we make you think we do.

- I mean, Kevin might.

- Well Kevin might, but we don't know everything. We don't know everything about every market we're in. We don't know everything about all ground prep. But what we do know is that there are people out there who know all the things that we don't. And so we really built this business on strategic partnerships, I mean from day one. If we wanted to grow into a market or go into a product line that we thought there was a space for, we would seek out absolute industry leaders, and seek their advice and seek their working with us, and building a relationship and a partnership. And we did that in 2009 with a installation company for infields, and talked to them about what the needs were for the maintenance of ball diamonds. You know, warning tracks, in fields, property, gravel, parking lots, anything that a municipality would have to deal with. And this company really gave us some great advice. And we went to work, and one of the favorite stories I have is that you know, this company gave Kevin 10 ideas, and in eight days we had prototypes built.

- That's incredible.

- And within eight days we had applied for patents. And those patents are still withstanding, and still being used on the products that were invented within eight days. So necessity sometimes creates urgency, right. And we felt an urgency in 2009, let me tell you, as most of the world did. And that's when we broke into the sports turf.

- So, I mean, with that many years working on ball fields then, like you've probably got some great stories. This one stand out of like a ball field that you were, I don't know, are you allowed to name it? Are you allowed to say what ball field? Are you allowed to say what ball field you were working on?

- Yeah, I can do this one I think. There is one.

- I know there's some we're not allowed to talk about.

- I'm not gonna mention his name.

- [Matt] No kidding.

- And I'm not gonna go into great detail about who he is, but he was the heads ground keeper, I don't know if he still is, but he was. He just wanted to tell me that we had saved his job. He said he was on the verge of being fired because he could not control ground rule doubles. So a ground rule double, so when the ball hits the warning track bounces up and goes over the fence. Well that's a ground rule double, automatic double, right. He could not control it. It either was too hard, and the ball was hitting and going into the bleachers, or it was too soft and the athletes were complaining 'cause they couldn't run fast enough. So he couldn't get this perfect balance. And literally, that's all it takes in the major league baseball to get fired. They could not control it. He had the worst statistics for ground rule doubles in the entire major league baseball, MBL. And he bought this machine from us, and the first season that he did it, he ended up ranked number one for infield, ground rule doubles. And he said literally he was able to manipulate the ground to make it firm enough to run, soft enough so not all the balls that hit, bounced so high and went over the fence. So that's kind of a story that stands out. And you know, we also put in the new infield for the Yankees. And so, you know, we've been involved in major league, minor league, collegiate, all the way down to Little League. Gosh, we've had churches buy our equipment for their softball field. So yeah, so we had some good stories.

- That's so fun.

- Well, you were in customer service. I mean, you probably heard a bunch of stories from our sports turf.

- Oh yeah, well that's I think the working with folks in the sports surf industry is probably some of the the funnest stories for that reason. Like, it's work that we love, it's work that that people love doing, but it's also like for the sake of a game, right. Like what you're doing is making a game more fun. What you're doing is making a game-

- Oh we use the slogan, for the love of the game.

- Yeah, yeah, so I think there's like passion and drive there when you're working with people who work on infields that you don't always get to work with with just customers of just any old products. So yeah, it's absolutely some of the funnest people to work with. Which I know is one reason why you were a big fan of kind of putting this whole thing together and bringing people in, and get to know a couple of these people, and give an opportunity to share some stories.

- Well, we get to share stories. But I think more importantly we get to learn. I mean, there's nobody better to learn from than your customers. I mean, you can sit behind a computer, you can theorize in a boardroom, you can talk to your engineers till you're blue in the face. But if you're not out there with, you know, the shovel in the hand, and the infield under your feet, you really don't know what you need. And so, you know, we need to learn. We're always learning, we're always modifying and changing and redesigning. You know, the old story is, if you do what you've always done you'll get what you've always got. So we're always trying to get better, and I think this is a great platform to bring people who are at the grassroots of this business. And bring 'em in and learn from 'em and let them tell their stories. Everybody has stories, everybody does.

- What's one thing, so you mentioned the things that we've learned from people in industry. What is one kind of aspect of grounds care or soil maintenance that you're just shocked by, that you would've never thought that this was true in groundwork, and it is. And now it's incorporated into some of the design.

- Yeah, into the design, that's a tricky one. Well, you know, I played Little League. I mean, I didn't play high school. I was a golfer, sorry, baseball people, I was a golfer. But I played Little League. So I, you know, I played on the infields, and you never think about a difference in the tightness or in the depth of softness, or in the trueness of the bounce. You know, for Little Leagues you want it softer, Major League, it's like a tabletop. I mean it's hard as a rock. And the one thing that, you know, a novice probably wouldn't understand, the people in the industry know this. But it's really about the moisture. I mean, moisture controls so much of the density, so much of the compaction. And then obviously, you have the loosening mechanics. You know, well this is how little we knew when we first got into baseball. We had these big old ripping Scarifier with tips on 'em. You know, we were ripping three inches deep. 'Cause that's what we did, we were a landscape contracting company. I mean that's what our equipment started as. And then in the equine market, you know, two, three, four inches. So we just thought, well baseball, let's just go rip it up. You know, so that was not the right answer. And we quickly found that out, we learned a lot.

- And we're not working in three inches, we're working in-

- Quarter inch.

- Like half an inch.

- Quarter inch, you know, it depends on whether you're in the Major League or if you're in in Little League. It really, that all changes. and that's the thing, an infield is not just an infield. It is designed specifically for those who are using it, at all levels. And it's all about safety, performance, you know, fun, love for the game. But it is not simply going out with a hand rake and raking it, and smooth out the cleats.

- Well and I think one thing-

- That's not what it is.

- That shocked me and that I had no, I mean just because you grew up in your own world and you're used to your own world. As you start talking to people all over the country, all over the world, is the different preferences in the type of soil used in these contexts, right? So yes, the moisture, yes, like the level of compaction and the density of soil. But some people prefer a higher clay content. Some people prefer more sand in their soil. Just all the field is dependent upon kind of the soil they've got available. Are they willing to truck in soil from across the the country? There's way more personal preference involved than what I ever realized.

- Well, I mean there's also the climate. I mean, you may be in an area that gets a lot of rain, we are going to need less clay. 'Cause you gotta have a little bit of percolation. But if you have too much sand and not enough clay, then it's too loose. And so, it is a science. There is nothing, you just don't go out and maintain an infield. You have to know your stuff, and you gotta know what your organization needs. You need to know what your community wants. You wanna know what your athletes need. You wanna know, you know, what your climate is. And you know there are places that in the middle of July, it's like a dust bowl. I mean it's just hard as a rock, 'cause they get no rain. And so you've gotta have equipment, and you have to have knowledge to be able to make that a safe and playable place, you know. So it'll be really interesting talking to some of these experts, and some of these groundskeepers as we bring 'em in and talk to 'em about this season. I think it'll be great to learn from them and hear their stories, 'cause I know there's some good ones. I've heard 'em.

- So that actually bleeds perfectly into the-

- That's what I do. I set you up for absolute perfection, go ahead.

- I don't even know. This whole season, this next couple of episodes we've got here on this podcast is working with ground keepers, working with professionals who are actually from around the country and working in different climates, and working in different soil preferences, and working at different levels of the industry. And we're excited to pick their brains. And I know that these are conversations like this that we get to have all the time, you know, our engineers and our product specialists. And we get to talk with industry leaders, but sometimes people who are working in the trenches, local fields, local high schools, local ball fields don't always have the opportunity to hear from professionals.

- Well, and I wanna go back to my point. Yes, we have a lot of knowledge, but I do not sit here and tell you I'm an expert on ball field maintenance, I am not. I'm more of a businessman, and we have engineers who are professionals at engineering. And we have product development people who are professionals at product development. But these people we're gonna be bringing in are experts in ball field maintenance. And in addition to bringing industry experts from the outside in, we do have people who know their business inside ABI's walls. And we're gonna be listening to some of those stories, and some of those expert, you know, thoughts, as we bring in people who have been in the industry, who have been with us for so many years that they have learned the expertise of this market. And we're gonna be learning from some of our own experts as well as the as the industry leaders who are on the outside of our walls.

- That's fantastic. Yeah, it's gonna be a fun season.

- It is gonna be great. You're gonna find this hard to believe, I'm excited about working with you.

- Oh, right on.

- Isn't that that sweet? This is gonna be fun.

- Yeah no, this is gonna be really great. I'm excited that we can just ask questions. Like you said, it's been years, decades now of us asking questions of the people doing the work to help figure out how we can best equip people. And so to have those people around the table and pick their brains a little bit, it's gonna be interesting for me. And hopefully some great fun listening.

- Why don't you tell 'em to watch?

- Oh, that's a good idea. You should, clearly we are excited about this season. Hope you are too, would love for you to follow along. So tune in, either watch, listen, whatever's best for you, and we're excited to have you along for their stories.